I have tua same issues in vmix!

NDI <> NDI|HX.

NDI has less than one frame of delay.
- PTZOptics Gen 3 cameras use NDI.
- BirdDog Studio uses NDI.

NDI|HX adds several frames of delay.
- Newtek Spark uses NDI|HX.
- Newtek PTZ Camera (NewTek NDIHX-PTZ1) uses NDI|HX.
- The Panasonic cameras (AW-HN38, AW-HN40, AW-UN70 and AW-HN130) use NDI|HX.

NDI|HX itself causes the delay. It has nothing to do with vMix.

You can't go back in time. You can only delay OTHER sources to match the video from the NDI|HX sources.

I'm pretty sure all the PTZOptics NDI-capable cameras are NDI|HX...

Can you please stop derailing this thread?

There are latency tests showing a much lower latency with NDI|HX than I experience in my setup at the moment (just open that videos).
And I just want to know, what I can do, to improve latency with NDI|HX on a vMix machine.

Thanks!

P.S.: I know, that there has to more latency than SDI. I know it is not "real NDI". But it has it's use cases.

The fact that the Newtek PTZ1 camera appears to offer NDI|HX that's actually in sync with its SDI output suggest that they might delay the SDI stream.

It would be interesting to see the camera compared to another camera, feeding the switcher via SDI. And both pointed at a rotary clock.

I want to buy some PTZ cameras in the next weeks and hope, that I can try out a NewTek PTZ1 at my dealer.
I don't have a problem with some kind of delay. It's just that in my configuration it's over 200 ms. That doesn't work well with joystick control.

Let me help answer a few things here.

Currently there are no cameras on the market with full bandwidth NDI built in. NDI|HX is taking existing encoding circuitry that is already built into cameras and re-programming with to output something that is low latency, but due to the LongGOP structure of the format, it will never be as low as full bandwidth NDI. I don't believe that NewTek ever said these units will be zero latency, in fact it is impossible to have zero latency thru any digital device no matter what signal we are talking about.

Once FPGA chips are available (which is what NewTek is doing with the Connect Spark Pro), then there will be something for camera manufactures to build into their designs.

As for NDI|HX latency, that all depends on the device. The PTZ cameras appear to have lower latency, because the compression chips on the unit have quicker access to the video data (right off the sensor) while Spark unit will appear a bit higher, because they don't get the signal until 'after' it comes out of the camera. Even HDMI and SDI outputs have some amount of image processing to get sensor data into a valid HDMI/SDI signal, so while we might call these outputs real-time, they too can be frame or two behind the image coming into the glass.

Attached is a quick latency test I took using a JVC camera via SDI, PTZ1 camera via NDI|HX and a HDMI and SDI Spark units coming off the JVC camera. There is no genlock, so the difference between the JVC and the PTZ1 can have some amount of difference because of that. Video format and frame rate can also cause differences in the latency, overall I recommend going for the highest video frame rate possible. In my test I used 1080p59.94 video input, sent everything into a TriCaster and put all four inputs into an M/E and then did a image grab of the M/E.

Kane Peterson
NewTek

I'll have to test it when I get back home. But I'm half a world away right now, so it will be a little bit.

Kane Peterson
NewTek

Thanks for the test.

Are you sure this clock is good?. A lot of internet stopwatch has 40- 50ms increments between steps.

Whats the latency between stopwatch and vmix monitor?. I ask because some cameras has very high latency on sdi. If you compare a camera with 4 frames latency, sdi or ndi, this is too much latency. Is better to change to a 1 frame latency camera.

Regards

Jose.

I tried your clock on my macbook pro and i found that time between each step of this clock is 44ms. 44ms=2,75frames at 1080@60p. I think is better to find a timecode generator or something similar, at least you will get 1frame between steps.
I think most important thing is total latency. If a camera has 5 frames latency on sdi and 6-7 frames latency on NDI, at least for me is too much. I want NDI like all of you, but please try to add total latency of camera on each output. Comparison between both outputs is not enough information in my opinion.

I attach what we usually do when compare latencies.

Regards

Jose.