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doggy  
#21 Posted : Tuesday, January 14, 2020 2:54:50 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Nazarene Israel Go to Quoted Post
Also, another question would be, what is the best way to record the keyed video file with an Alpha channel?
Because we want to key out the green background here, and then send the keyed file (with Alpha channel) to our video editors, so they can manipulate the images in post. Is there a best wrapper / codec?



Vmix output with alpha channel to NDI 4.0 Studio Monitor & Record there

or

Record the output as NDI with alpha using NewTek codec with alpha, and use adobe media encoder,


found with forum search ;-)
thanks 1 user thanked doggy for this useful post.
Nazarene Israel on 1/14/2020(UTC)
Nazarene Israel  
#22 Posted : Tuesday, January 14, 2020 11:42:32 PM(UTC)
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Doggy, awesome! I came up with nothing.!
What search terms did you use?
(Maybe I need some remedial instruction on how to search???? It would not be surprising! Lol...)
mjgraves  
#23 Posted : Thursday, January 16, 2020 3:29:49 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Nazarene Israel Go to Quoted Post
We set the ATEM Mini and the Datavideo DVK-300HD up side by side for a test today, and the Datavideo clearly won. (We did not take any screen shots, but the Datavideo key was clearly much better.)


Pity you didn't save some sample images or media. That would have been useful to many people.

doggy  
#24 Posted : Thursday, January 16, 2020 4:10:59 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Nazarene Israel Go to Quoted Post
Doggy, awesome! I came up with nothing.!
What search terms did you use?
(Maybe I need some remedial instruction on how to search???? It would not be surprising! Lol...)


I honestly forgot but knew it was possible, i also search on google with vMix added ;-)

but:

vMix can export NDI with alpha channel,

here someone amended my option ( looks familiar ? ;-) ) https://forums.vmix.com/...equence-Export#post63928

and now the NDI studio monitor can record also with alpha channel included

And also now vMix can play that Studio monitor recording strait away with alpha channel included

thanks 1 user thanked doggy for this useful post.
Nazarene Israel on 1/16/2020(UTC)
Nazarene Israel  
#25 Posted : Thursday, January 16, 2020 11:22:09 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: mjgraves Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Nazarene Israel Go to Quoted Post
We set the ATEM Mini and the Datavideo DVK-300HD up side by side for a test today, and the Datavideo clearly won. (We did not take any screen shots, but the Datavideo key was clearly much better.)


Pity you didn't save some sample images or media. That would have been useful to many people.



Ok, well, we tested again today.
Here is the Datavideo picture of a wig, as good as my assistant could adjust the overall picture. It leaves most of the fine hair.
[img=UserPostedImage]Datavideo picture of a wig[/img]

And here is the ATEM Mini picture of a wig, as good as my assistant could adjust the overall picture. A lot of the fine hair is missing.
UserPostedImage

But the live switching function on the ATEM Mini is great! We hope to keep it just for that, and also as a backup.
Nazarene Israel  
#26 Posted : Thursday, January 16, 2020 11:31:06 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: doggy Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Nazarene Israel Go to Quoted Post
Doggy, awesome! I came up with nothing.!
What search terms did you use?
(Maybe I need some remedial instruction on how to search???? It would not be surprising! Lol...)


I honestly forgot but knew it was possible, i also search on google with vMix added ;-)

but:

vMix can export NDI with alpha channel,

here someone amended my option ( looks familiar ? ;-) ) https://forums.vmix.com/...equence-Export#post63928

and now the NDI studio monitor can record also with alpha channel included

And also now vMix can play that Studio monitor recording strait away with alpha channel included



Ok, that is great to know!

Only, it turns out the Datavideo will not output with an alpha channel. So we will have to key it here.

But we think one thing maybe we can do is to key the green out here, and then replace it with a uniform solid green background, which our editors should be able to key out easily. Does that seem right?
mjgraves  
#27 Posted : Thursday, January 16, 2020 1:02:15 PM(UTC)
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The background in those sample images exhibit substantially different color balance. Was this the result of the keyer? When misadjusted that can happen.
Nazarene Israel  
#28 Posted : Thursday, January 16, 2020 1:24:21 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: mjgraves Go to Quoted Post
The background in those sample images exhibit substantially different color balance. Was this the result of the keyer? When misadjusted that can happen.


Oh, no, sorry, I should have mentioned that. We have a man recording footage loops. That was a test loop that we rejected, but we don't have the corrected loops yet. One still is with no clouds, and the other still is with clouds, so there is a color shift.

We will test again next week if there is anything specific we should try. He has some ideas about how to get an alpha channel out of the Datavideo, and through vMix. So we are going to try again.
Nazarene Israel  
#29 Posted : Friday, January 17, 2020 12:11:44 AM(UTC)
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Ehm, I woke up this morning realizing that some of that adjustment was because we had some shadows in the lower left and right hand corners, and my administrator had to take it out. I have two more lights, and I just ordered some stubby tripods, so we are going to add just a little light to the lower left and right, and then we can use less adjustment. But still, at least based on what we have seen so far, I don't think it will change the fact that the Datavideo key is much cleaner so far. If anything, it will just give us an even cleaner key on the Datavideo...

It would be great if BMD wanted to make a slightly better mid-range keyer, maybe like an "ATEM Mini Plus++", or something like that, somewhere in between the Mini and an Ultimatte. (But right now, the thought of dropping $10,000 plus a $3-4,000 controller for Ultimatte makes me want to cough.)
mjgraves  
#30 Posted : Friday, January 17, 2020 8:46:25 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Nazarene Israel Go to Quoted Post
It would be great if BMD wanted to make a slightly better mid-range keyer, maybe like an "ATEM Mini Plus++", or something like that, somewhere in between the Mini and an Ultimatte. (But right now, the thought of dropping $10,000 plus a $3-4,000 controller for Ultimatte makes me want to cough.)


It's always the middle market that dies.

Some people will pay for the very best.

Others will seek out the best deal, so the low-end is very active.

The middle gets squeezed. Low-end folks not able to justify the extra spend. High-end folks discounting their wares to win more business.

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