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Starting from scratch - no real technical understanding
Rank: Newbie
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Joined: 5/15/2017(UTC)
Posts: 5
Location: UK
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This is something I've been looking to do for a while but have always found the potential cost prohibitive when looking into other production switchers options that will allow me achieve the professional look I desire.vMix seems to offers the features I need, coupled with the fact the cost of streaming is much less prohibitive now I would like an option that would allow me to produce live coverage of a local non-league soccer team and studio discussion shows.
I have an understanding of what looks good, and it needs to be of broadcast quality but I have a budget of £5,000 this includes the switcher and several cameras and audio.I'm prepared to sacrifice on the quality of the cameras initially as that can come later, as long as the main infrastructure is in place. Bearing in my mind the budget is around £5,000 (US$6,500), what would people recommend in terms of cameras and the PC build etc.
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Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 3/7/2012(UTC) Posts: 2,604  Location: Canada Thanks: 33 times
Was thanked: 501 time(s) in 470 post(s)
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@ NewtoVmix
How many cameras are you hoping to start with?
There are many factors to consider overall, all of which will impact how you go about building your production system and equipment.
When you say "Broadcast Quality", what do you mean by this?
Is the production (and/or footage) going to broadcast on Television or just the Internet?
(Broadcast standards are fairly specific and will eat through your budget in no time)
How committed are you to the project and "building for the future" or is it more a matter of getting outfitted adequately from the get go with the budget you have?
Laptop or Desktop?
I could ask a hundred more questions, but the bottom line is, vMix is likely the best option for you on the Software side of things, but how "Pro" you go will come down to how much more you intend to invest down the road. If there is just too much uncertainty about the future, you should be able to effectively outfit yourself within that budget, it just might not be up to professional standards.
Ice
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Rank: Newbie
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Joined: 5/15/2017(UTC)
Posts: 5
Location: UK
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Two or three cameras initially high-end consumer ones with HDMI outputs. It would just be for streaming at this stage. I would like to build desktop PC for this, but no nothing about building computers. Ideally something that could more cameras with SDI inputs later down the line.
For football coverage, I'm thinking of running the scorebar and timer in vMix and the rest of the lower third/team sheet graphics from PowerPoint with a green background from a separate laptop, as this would be easier to edit on the fly and allow for subtle but effective animations. Is this feasible or cause any problems?
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Rank: Newbie
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Joined: 5/15/2017(UTC)
Posts: 5
Location: UK
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Looking into a new build from scratch and seeing the cost of the capture cards needed I'm wonder whether something like the Atem Television Studio pro may be a better solution. I like the idea of having a roving camera for interviews etc which would be an iPhone on a DJI Osmo using NDI and the replay feature however which I'm not going to get with the BlackMagic product so I'm torn on this. Im not sure how easy it is to stream from that machine either.
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Rank: Advanced Member
Groups: Registered
Joined: 3/7/2012(UTC) Posts: 2,604 Location: Canada Thanks: 33 times
Was thanked: 501 time(s) in 470 post(s)
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@ NewtoVmix
In my humble opinion, vMix is the better option in the long run. The ATEM is very attractive from an initial cost perspective, but it certainly has limitations and would need to be built upon and added to down the road. Many vMix users have (and do, see Siroki) use the two products in conjunction with each other, but it is a compromise and not the best overall workflow for either product. For many who have gone down this path, they eventually opt to drop the ATEM and go 100% with vMix (see CPilcher).
As alluded to in my previous post, you can easily start small with vMix and build from there as you are able, but how you build will determine the overall long term costs vs your initial capabilities. You could begin relatively cheaply with vMix HD and a couple consumer cameras connected with USB 3 capture dongles, although this will increase the overall long term costs if you adopt different technologies to the workflow down the road (i.e. SDI cameras and Capture cards), never a complete waste, but I think you see my point.
If you choose to build for the future now, you will eat through most of your budget with top of the line components and a x4 or x8 SDI capture card and an SDI camera, which limits your initial capabiliies...
My advise would be to start small with the minimum capabilities you can live with (one or two cameras) with an eye to expanding in the future. Establish a firm budget for each link in the chain and maximize your capabilities within that budget. That is, outfit yourself with the tools you need to get that job done now with the understanding that you WILL expand or improve as you are able as you move forward.
We all wish we had unlimited budgets, but the reality is that tough decisions need to be made all the time and there is no absolute right or wrong, just what is the best option for right now.
Keep us all posted.
Ice
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Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 6/29/2016(UTC)
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Hey and welcome, I would definetly go with vmix rather than the ATEM, you can still invest in it when things start rolling. One question I think is important. You say you want to stream Football, how about the distance ? How far will the cameras be away from each other as this will determine 1. the capture device, maybe 2. the cameras and of course 3. cabling. Remember that HDMI cables should not be longer than 20-25 meters to maintain quality. So what you could do is look for SDI capture device like the BM Deckling Duo 2 (with 4 SDI in/out) and get HDMI2SDI Converters (also from BM) to bring the signal to your pc over variable distances without losing quality. Of course you can use USB 3.0 capture dongles (Magewell e.g.) either HDMI or SDI but buying 2 of these will result in one BMDuo2. This is just my opinion As for PC specs I would suggest you look at the reference systems http://www.vmix.com/prod...erence-systems.aspx#ruby and get sthg in between Emerald and Ruby :o) Hope that helps. PM me if you need further reviews on the mistakes we did with about the same budget to start ... Cheers,
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Rank: Newbie
Groups: Registered
Joined: 5/15/2017(UTC)
Posts: 5
Location: UK
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My two HDMI cameras would initially within 15 meters of the computer, although I'd go down the route of the SDI converters.
For the build then.
G Skill Trident DDR 4 (£145.99)
intel 5 motherboard (£159.99)
Core i7 (£327.93)
Windows 10 (£99.99)
Samsung 1TB SSD (£299.99)
Blackmagic Decklink Quad 2 (£420)
600w Power supply (£27.99)
Blackmagic HDMI to SDI (£77.99) x2
Case £79.99
Total build cost £1,233.94 ----) Does this seem about right cost wise? Have I missed anything? Obviously not factoring in the end vMix porgramme at this stage, audio or cameras.
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Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 4/13/2015(UTC)
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@NewtoVmix It appears your build will need a video card?
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Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 8/2/2013(UTC) Posts: 1,035  Location: Fairhope, Alabama USA Thanks: 543 times
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NewtoVmix wrote:Blackmagic Decklink Quad 2 (£420)
Do you mean the Blackmagic Decklink Duo 2 (4-port HD-SDI capture)?
- Tom
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Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 4/14/2013(UTC) Posts: 264 Location: Australia Thanks: 35 times
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You could start with a DUO 2, 4 ins and add another later or a Quad.
What GPU ? Aim for a 1070 or 1080.
Also think about used gear, a quality used tripod would be better than a cheap new one.
I have 3 used Decklink cards, no issues but it's hard to find a good price compared to new.
The Behringer UMC404HD U-Phoria 4x4 USB Audio Interface is a quality unit for mics close to the PC.
I have an AIR XR18 but there's the XR 12 that gives you plenty.
Vmix is really a no brainer, you can option it up and it's always being improved too. Having everything in the one box makes it easy.
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Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 5/13/2014(UTC) Posts: 515  Location: Manchester, UK Thanks: 2 times
Was thanked: 183 time(s) in 130 post(s)
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@NewtoVmix - I don't know where in the UK you are, but if you'd like to have a chat or see a vMix setup (in Manchester) I'd be happy to help.
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