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Multiple streams critically dependant on each other
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Joined: 2/16/2017(UTC) Posts: 178 Location: Denmark
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With vMix being able to stream to three simultaneous destinations, we have often used it in a setup like this:
Stream 1) Facebook account #1 Stream 2) Facebook account #2 Stream 3) Youtube account #1, primary
However, this turns out to be a very risky approach. If you stop the live stream in Facebook account #1 (in the Facebook web browser interface), this can affect the other streams in vMix, basically making not just Stream 1 fail, but also Stream 2 and Stream 3 in vMix. This means that if a persistent connection failure occurs in either stream, all streams in vMix will be risked.
I have seen this behaviour many times in the latest version of vMix, 20.0.0.30.
As a result, we now send a just a single live stream from each vMix machine to Wowza Streaming Cloud and from there forward the streams to the different CDN's.
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Joined: 8/5/2017(UTC) Posts: 135 Location: UK
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Might be worth exploring a repeater service like restream.io we use this to stream to Youtube and Facebook while sending out a single stream from vmix. It is a paid service, but not too expensive and no bandwidth or data limitations. You can stream to Youtube for free, but custom RTMP streams are $7.50 a month as far as I recall.
edit: ah I see you already do...
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Joined: 3/28/2016(UTC) Posts: 159 Location: SACRAMENTO Thanks: 5 times Was thanked: 19 time(s) in 18 post(s)
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Yes restream is a very good alternative being it's basically free with the exception of custom RTMP and transcoding like nowski said. This is my biggest problem with vMix when it comes to their streaming side. Once you start you can't do anything unless you kill the stream. I would love to stream using the tool only and start and stop other streams as I chose. I get around it by sending the feeds out via external and use another system(s) to do this but i'm curious why vmix does this or doesn't allow the option of a more rebust multi-stream solution. :( niemi wrote:With vMix being able to stream to three simultaneous destinations, we have often used it in a setup like this:
Stream 1) Facebook account #1 Stream 2) Facebook account #2 Stream 3) Youtube account #1, primary
However, this turns out to be a very risky approach. If you stop the live stream in Facebook account #1 (in the Facebook web browser interface), this can affect the other streams in vMix, basically making not just Stream 1 fail, but also Stream 2 and Stream 3 in vMix. This means that if a persistent connection failure occurs in either stream, all streams in vMix will be risked.
I have seen this behaviour many times in the latest version of vMix, 20.0.0.30.
As a result, we now send a just a single live stream from each vMix machine to Wowza Streaming Cloud and from there forward the streams to the different CDN's.
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Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 2/16/2017(UTC) Posts: 178 Location: Denmark
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NiBTour wrote:... I would love to stream using the tool only and start and stop other streams as I chose. ... To be able to control and start/stop the 3 streams independently would be a nice feature, but controlling the streams in an independent way would also require further development of the interface. Right now it is not really a requirement from our side, however independant stream behaviour really is. We cannot having one bad stream literally stopping the other two streams. It is a serious problem.
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It's true! Also serious problem for us. Missing feature... niemi wrote:NiBTour wrote:... I would love to stream using the tool only and start and stop other streams as I chose. ... To be able to control and start/stop the 3 streams independently would be a nice feature, but controlling the streams in an independent way would also require further development of the interface. Right now it is not really a requirement from our side, however independant stream behaviour really is. We cannot having one bad stream literally stopping the other two streams. It is a serious problem.
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Not really. You can keep the tabs the exact same but just don't disable them when streaming and allow to start and stop interdependently which in turn wouldn't make one stream dependent on the other. i do agree with you though where the more important issue is if your allowing 3 streams don't let one break the other. I use restream.io now so neither are that big of a deal. it's more of a shocker it hasn't happened yet then anything else. niemi wrote:NiBTour wrote:... I would love to stream using the tool only and start and stop other streams as I chose. ... To be able to control and start/stop the 3 streams independently would be a nice feature, but controlling the streams in an independent way would also require further development of the interface. Right now it is not really a requirement from our side, however independant stream behaviour really is. We cannot having one bad stream literally stopping the other two streams. It is a serious problem.
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and also the option of 3 streams with the same encode, if we uses the 3 streams with "use stream 1 quality" and the first uses hardware encoder not work, us vmix uses ffmpeg this is easy to add.
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NiBTour wrote:... I use restream.io now so neither are that big of a deal. it's more of a shocker it hasn't happened yet then anything else ...
Thanks NiBTour. How solid a service to you consider restream.io to be? Have you seen any issues yet, and how many live streams have you been using it for?
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I have contacted the vMix team twice about this, and while I have always been impressed with their responsiveness, this issue doesn't seem to be a priority. At least I haven't heard anything for several weeks now.
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Bouncing this back to attention...
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Hi, At the moment all streams in vMix are all linked together by design. We recommend the following approaches where more flexibility is required: 1. Use the vMix NDI output to another laptop or PC that can be used as an independent encoder for another stream. This allows full control over the secondary stream using something like vMix Basic HD, or the other free streaming encoders available. 2. Use a rebroadcasting service such as Restream.io https://restream.io/This option has the added benefit of reducing the bandwidth requirements of your local connection as the distribution is handled in the "cloud". 3. Consider streaming to a single provider and embedding that stream into the other social networks you wish to stream to. For example when using YouTube Live you can embed that into Facebook and Twitter posts directly for example. Hope this helps, Regards, Martin vMix
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admin wrote:Hi, At the moment all streams in vMix are all linked together by design. We recommend the following approaches where more flexibility is required: 1. Use the vMix NDI output to another laptop or PC that can be used as an independent encoder for another stream. This allows full control over the secondary stream using something like vMix Basic HD, or the other free streaming encoders available. 2. Use a rebroadcasting service such as Restream.io https://restream.io/This option has the added benefit of reducing the bandwidth requirements of your local connection as the distribution is handled in the "cloud". 3. Consider streaming to a single provider and embedding that stream into the other social networks you wish to stream to. For example when using YouTube Live you can embed that into Facebook and Twitter posts directly for example. Hope this helps, Regards, Martin vMix Or Switchboard.live also adds similar features to restream.io > One stream out to multiple destinations that all can be controlled
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admin wrote:At the moment all streams in vMix are all linked together by design.
Thanks Martin, any chance for a separation of the streams in a future release?
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niemi wrote:Thanks Martin, any chance for a separation of the streams in a future release? Independent stream control (as mentioned in #3) would be great, but for now, simply unlinking the three streams would be a major, major fix. Is it possible?
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I am looking for the streaming in vMix to work in a sensible way, which means separating the three streams so they won't take each other down.
Why not fix it?
Restream solutions might serve well as a stopgap, but it doesn't change the fact that a design change is really missed in vMix.
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