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DWAM  
#1 Posted : Saturday, October 21, 2017 6:02:37 AM(UTC)
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Hi!

Still looking for solutions for multicam color matching, a new idea came to my mind... Meanwhile there is a real professional solution integrated into vMix, it'd be great if we could already control color correction in realtime via the API. As the case may be, we could design our own applications of what I call a "vision module".

Step 1 : Add existing controls to the API. This concerns Martin mostly

Add missing API commands for everything that concerns input processing:
- RGB, Saturation, B&W stretching.
- White Balance would be great too, but I don't know if it's possible (due to the need to click in the popup image)
- More ? I checked but maybe I forgot something here...

Step 2 : Design "Vision Modules" for color matching. This concerns vMix (potentially) and all of us (via third-party solutions).

When we have the ability to control all aspects of input processing via the API, we are in a position where we can start building/designing solutions for realtime correction.
For instance :
- we could use a Midi Controller with knobs to adjust the settings per input
- I have already started to design a vMix UTC project for the same purpose (based on existing API commands)
- Vmix could add a new tab in the WebController for this
- Developers could create new apps on all sorts of devices for this.

Though it would be quite basic for a start, it would be great already to be able to adjust color settings in a dedicated interface where inputs would be presented next to each other with direct access to all available parameters (like an audio mixer or a real CCU) and see the changes at once without having to do several clicks in the vMix GUI. This would allow aswell to have a dedicated operator (let's call him a vision engineer) doing this on a remote computer (like it is usually done in broadcast workflows).

Step 3 : Add full Saturation/Hue/Luminance controls in vMix and the API. For Martin again

Hue and Luminance are very important for color matching in video production.
Others controls like contrast or whatever could be added too. Make suggestions if you have ideas.

Step 4 : Even better ?

As discussed in another Feature Request I initiated (see: https://forums.vmix.com/....aspx?g=posts&t=8662 ), the integration of X-Rite or even LUTS into vMix is still imho a hot topic. Maybe some of you have better ideas?

Thanks
Guillaume
thanks 3 users thanked DWAM for this useful post.
PFBM on 10/21/2017(UTC), ON.tv Channels on 10/22/2017(UTC), bartek on 11/11/2017(UTC)
Streamverse.tv  
#2 Posted : Saturday, October 21, 2017 7:09:31 AM(UTC)
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+1
tbimages  
#3 Posted : Saturday, October 21, 2017 7:26:24 AM(UTC)
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+1

Just exposing the existing controls via API would be huge in itself.
DWAM  
#4 Posted : Saturday, October 21, 2017 7:28:07 AM(UTC)
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Sure! Thanks Blake!
Stavlin  
#5 Posted : Saturday, October 21, 2017 8:02:59 AM(UTC)
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+1

I'd take just exposing the controls to the API in Step 1, but would love to see this progress through the whole list.

Joe
avsoundguy  
#6 Posted : Saturday, October 21, 2017 10:35:03 AM(UTC)
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Ittaidv  
#7 Posted : Saturday, October 21, 2017 10:54:11 AM(UTC)
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+1 + 1 +1 +1 :)

Color correction is the only feature still needed to deliver true professional results with Vmix in my opinion. When I first started using it, pro audio and external output options were the big issues, but they are all solved. I support every request that could lead to some kind of 'shading' in vmix. This week we were asked to work for a National broadcaster, and had to ensure our colors would stay in balance during the entire broadcast, which will happen during the golden hour. I know already my only task during this hour will be to continuously run from cam to cam to adjust the colors in the menus.

@DWAM: I'm not a programmer, but would it be hard to write some kind of program that uses the capture card input, allows changes, and sends a virtual camera out? A bit like those virtual webcam programs, that allow you to use your webcam in multiple softwares at once. I've also been checking out graphedit, and i think it could be possible to create a 'brdige' program with graphedit between the capture cards and vmix. I noticed there are many virtualdub filters available for free, and they can be loaded by grapheditplus : http://www.infognition.c...rs/color_correction.html Perhaps a programmer could integrate something like this into some sort of bridge app?

DWAM  
#8 Posted : Saturday, October 21, 2017 11:55:38 AM(UTC)
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Quote:
@DWAM: I'm not a programmer, but would it be hard to write some kind of program that uses the capture card input, allows changes, and sends a virtual camera out?


It already exists with NDI support Ittai: NDI Connect Pro ! https://www.newtek.com/connect/connect-pro/

As of using VirtualDub's plugins, well, I'm not sure... ;o) But thanks for the link "back to the past" it's at least 10/12 years since I last considered virtualdub as a solution for my needs. I'm kidding !
Peter B  
#9 Posted : Saturday, October 21, 2017 6:19:54 PM(UTC)
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+1

Having finer control of RGB levels would make them more useful.
Then a colour wheel interface, easier to relate to, then some user presets.

Luminance gamma too.
Peter B  
#10 Posted : Saturday, October 21, 2017 6:33:35 PM(UTC)
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Ittaidv wrote:
+1 + 1 +1 +1 :)

I know already my only task during this hour will be to continuously run from cam to cam to adjust the colors in the menus.




Resolve in live mode could be a downstream colour corrector for your application.

but -
there's a 6 or so frame delay, you need BMD sdi in and out cards, mini monitors / recorders should work.
ON.tv Channels  
#11 Posted : Sunday, October 22, 2017 3:33:37 AM(UTC)
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+1
Ittaidv  
#12 Posted : Sunday, October 22, 2017 3:44:21 AM(UTC)
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Peter B wrote:
Ittaidv wrote:
+1 + 1 +1 +1 :)

I know already my only task during this hour will be to continuously run from cam to cam to adjust the colors in the menus.




Resolve in live mode could be a downstream colour corrector for your application.

but -
there's a 6 or so frame delay, you need BMD sdi in and out cards, mini monitors / recorders should work.



This would require a lot of pc's or virtual machines, and would be a problem to handle by 1 person. It's not made for this :)
Peter B  
#13 Posted : Sunday, October 22, 2017 12:37:46 PM(UTC)
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Ittaidv wrote:
Peter B wrote:
Ittaidv wrote:
+1 + 1 +1 +1 :)

I know already my only task during this hour will be to continuously run from cam to cam to adjust the colors in the menus.




Resolve in live mode could be a downstream colour corrector for your application.

but -
there's a 6 or so frame delay, you need BMD sdi in and out cards, mini monitors / recorders should work.



This would require a lot of pc's or virtual machines, and would be a problem to handle by 1 person. It's not made for this :)


I was thinking of one machine downstream of vMix, but then everything including supers would be graded.
richardgatarski  
#14 Posted : Sunday, October 22, 2017 3:19:16 PM(UTC)
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+1

re white balance API, set % for x and y pos of frame for color picker (which of course needs Step 2 implementation)
RichShumaker  
#15 Posted : Sunday, October 22, 2017 3:59:31 PM(UTC)
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+1

I understand what Martin has said in the past, who would know how to use 'advanced color correction' properly.
I agree with him I wouldn't, the cool thing is others would.
Those others would create tutorials and teach us Noob Hack Idiots how to do it.

Then we all grow as a community both because we have a complicated feature we all need to figure out together, and because our system does something others software can 'sorta' do 'kinda' but not 'really'.
This community and this software are an amazing ecosystem that other software companies dream about.

Thanks for this suggestion even if I don't completely understand the underlying tech, I understand making all cameras look the same = 'professional'.

Rich Shumaker
Innomedia  
#16 Posted : Monday, October 23, 2017 3:39:37 AM(UTC)
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+1

In my opinion the API is extremely powerful and THE key for professional use of vMix. If the capabilities of the API will be enhanced in general (not limited to color correction only) the vMix community is able to develop more tools for different professional purposes. Think for example of "synchronizing" two or more machines in instant replay with a SETTIMECODE function. There are many topics in all areas of a more professional use of vMix. Please implement more API functions to give the people out there more chances to create applications for their needs. In the end many users will participate and benefit from this enhancement.

Regards
Karsten
DWAM  
#17 Posted : Monday, October 23, 2017 6:16:01 AM(UTC)
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1000% agree Karsten. I feel the exact same way
StepBackInTime_TV  
#18 Posted : Tuesday, October 24, 2017 6:31:36 AM(UTC)
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+1

As an interim measure, it would be good if the existing RGB colour controls could *multiply* the incoming colour values rather than just adding to them.

This could be implemented as a check-box to change the behavior.

Advantage of doing this?

Lets say you have a scene that is too yellow. Currently you have 2 choices - either add blue, or subtract red+green.

If you add blue, the black level becomes tinted blue - not nice.

If you subtract Red+Green, you crush the blacks.

If however the Blue value was multiplied, then black would remain black, and the brighter shades would have extra blue - solving the black level problem and provide a basic colour correction.

All the best,
G.
thanks 2 users thanked StepBackInTime_TV for this useful post.
Peter B on 10/24/2017(UTC), rowby on 2/22/2018(UTC)
Yannick  
#19 Posted : Tuesday, October 24, 2017 7:30:07 AM(UTC)
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SHMD  
#20 Posted : Wednesday, October 25, 2017 9:12:10 PM(UTC)
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