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Audioman  
#1 Posted : Sunday, April 16, 2017 10:16:55 AM(UTC)
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Good morning, and sorry for my english, I'm Italian.

I am a software developer for audio, and I met a few days vMix.
I usually for video, using Sony Broadcast equipment.

I downloaded the demo version, and I immediately noticed that although being flexible, the shortcuts (including MIDI), NOT have a return, so it is very difficult to use/create an control surface software or hardware.

An example: I possess numerous hardware switches Sony (example Sony bkds 2010).

For me is not a problem to realize a software that allows to control vMix from this surface, but without a return from vMix, it is almost impossible.

Another example: in a couple of hours I realized a software for Windows that allow you, to remotely control via wifi, but same problem.

I "borrowed" from another software the graphics, just to try it, and it works perfectly, but no return... it is useless!

I am attaching the photo, now work Program, Preview, Key 1,2,3,4, Cut, Auto (fade), transition rate.

If anyone is interested I can continue development, for now it is only 10 channels but I can also do 24-32 or more... but without a return (response) by vMix, I think it's just a waste of time.

It works with MIDI (using rtpMIDI) or Web, and works on any Windows OS (XP, Vista, 7, 8, 10), 32 or 64 bits.

UserPostedImage
xaver  
#2 Posted : Sunday, April 16, 2017 11:00:08 AM(UTC)
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with http://127.0.0.1:8088/api? you get many informations, but you have to pull the site
ghayden6  
#3 Posted : Sunday, April 16, 2017 12:29:22 PM(UTC)
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I like this. How can I get a copy?
Joeboe  
#4 Posted : Sunday, April 16, 2017 12:33:58 PM(UTC)
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How can I get a copy of this....where can I download it?
DWAM  
#5 Posted : Sunday, April 16, 2017 12:38:37 PM(UTC)
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Hi

you might also be able to use activators as it seems your app uses midi.
Another solution as indicated before is to use vMix API which indicates all states in realtime.

Guillaume
DWAM  
#6 Posted : Sunday, April 16, 2017 1:08:32 PM(UTC)
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Concerning your app, it seems well designed. Congrats!

However I think such an interface suits perfectly well for a traditional control panel for a traditional switcher, which vMix is not. I think such an interface does not take advantage of the hundreds of features that vMix has, in terms of M/E, in terms of outputs and so many others things.
Also, the terms like DSK, DVE, DIP, as well as the concept of color or bars generators are really out of the subject with vMix. We can do all this but not like it's done with traditional equipments. And it would be natural to find in a vMix Control Panel the same words as in vMix.

As I see it, your app is more like a limitation to vMix potential. vMix is not an ATEM or any other switcher. Maybe you need to understand the product better before trying to develop an application for it. vMix needs an optimized control panel with added-value.

As a comparison, maybe for your understanding, just look at this video I did lately about using a Midi Controller as a control panel for switching vMix. Most of the switches I do are not possible with your interface. You will understand how different your app needs to be to bring us a wonderful control panel which I'm sure you can do.
https://forums.vmix.com/....aspx?g=posts&t=9765

Cordiali saluti
Ciao

Guillaume
Joeboe  
#7 Posted : Sunday, April 16, 2017 2:38:47 PM(UTC)
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Audioman wrote:
Good morning, and sorry for my english, I'm Italian.

I am a software developer for audio, and I met a few days vMix.
I usually for video, using Sony Broadcast equipment.

I downloaded the demo version, and I immediately noticed that although being flexible, the shortcuts (including MIDI), NOT have a return, so it is very difficult to use/create an control surface software or hardware.

An example: I possess numerous hardware switches Sony (example Sony bkds 2010).

For me is not a problem to realize a software that allows to control vMix from this surface, but without a return from vMix, it is almost impossible.

Another example: in a couple of hours I realized a software for Windows that allow you, to remotely control via wifi, but same problem.

I "borrowed" from another software the graphics, just to try it, and it works perfectly, but no return... it is useless!

I am attaching the photo, now work Program, Preview, Key 1,2,3,4, Cut, Auto (fade), transition rate.

If anyone is interested I can continue development, for now it is only 10 channels but I can also do 24-32 or more... but without a return (response) by vMix, I think it's just a waste of time.

It works with MIDI (using rtpMIDI) or Web, and works on any Windows OS (XP, Vista, 7, 8, 10), 32 or 64 bits.

UserPostedImage




As a person who came out of a traditional mixer background, I must say this is a great looking GUI....However, I would remove the buttons at the bottom and place them to the right hand side of the "T" bar (Tbar)....since they are too close to the input select buttons and could be activated by accident.
al4video  
#8 Posted : Tuesday, April 18, 2017 4:34:15 PM(UTC)
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I like it. I would be interested.
Audioman  
#9 Posted : Wednesday, April 19, 2017 3:48:55 AM(UTC)
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As I said, the GUI is "borrowed", and being away from my final project.

Surely my software is a limitation to the potential of vMix, but it's a GUI, and as such should be understood.

My aim is to build a bridge to connect real surfaces (like Sony For-in etc.), But to make the bridge more quickly, I need a gui to work, and then I thought to realize also a software usable without real surface.

The bulk of the problem are the returns from vMix.
Can I rely only Tally light and a virtual serial, too many steps for my taste, because even implement MIDI return would be much easier for developers vMix.

For the moment nothing is not available for download, the screen is debug version, but I can create a compiled release.
DWAM  
#10 Posted : Wednesday, April 19, 2017 4:47:25 AM(UTC)
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Hi

It's not very clear what you call "returns". I suspect you are talking about vMix states.
As Xaver already told you, you can get all information about vMix anytime and in realtime using the API. Using it you have absolutely all "states" regarding all inputs and output use (except externals) and you can control nearly everything in vMix.
Furthermore, you can use several tally protocols and midi activators.

If this is not what you expect or need, what are you talking about?

Thanks for the precisions on your project. Keep us posted

Guillaume
Audioman  
#11 Posted : Wednesday, April 19, 2017 8:07:11 AM(UTC)
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Yes, as I intend for return the response of status from vMix.

I saw that with the web API I get all the status, but I do not think something "healthy" must continually call the API to know how to be the state that monent.

Much more professional if vMix sends in midi (or serial command) all the changes, the surfaces receiving the command and turn led off or on (led for example).

It is implemented everything, but this is missing.

Audioman  
#12 Posted : Wednesday, April 19, 2017 8:21:15 AM(UTC)
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Sorry, I talked about nothing.

I did not understand what they were activators ...

Found everything much easier !!!
DWAM  
#13 Posted : Wednesday, April 19, 2017 8:48:31 AM(UTC)
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Quote:
but I do not think something "healthy" must continually call the API to know how to be the state that monent.

Why? That's what API are designed for, no?
I understand you can be surprised, this is not conventional in audiovisual equipments, but I told you so: vMix is nothing like a traditional switcher! And you've got to understand how it works (which is much more powerful than other switchers) instead of waiting for vMix to work the "old" way: serial communications is history compared to a fully implemented API! Stone age is over!

As a reference for high API usage, I recommend you look at vMix UTC which makes an extensive use of the API. I noticed it can use the API several times each second without any issue, either on vMix side or UTC side. vMix is very very well and cleverly developed piece of software and it's rock-solid: you can safely call its API 10 times a second if you want, it won't bother.

vMix UTC : https://forums.vmix.com/....aspx?g=posts&t=6468
richardgatarski  
#14 Posted : Wednesday, April 19, 2017 10:36:24 AM(UTC)
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Guilla,

I believe Audioman has a point, although perhaps "something healthy" is not the best description ;)

vMix's API is designed as response only. That is, one (in this case Audioman) has to frequently call vMix and ask for its status. Whenever vMix's internal state changes (eg if a "Cut" is made), that information is not pushed outsidet (eg by an interrupt to another app). Actually, via the API you cannot know if a switch between two sources was cut, a fade, or whatever.

vMix's Activators supports most MIDI and X-Keys controllers, and are not part of the API. Just a limited subset of vMix actions are supported. Again, you cannot know when a Cut is made. Or which Overlay number an Input is turned on for, hence your very own Feature request New activators for Inputs used as Overlay in multiview or External2.

Note, I am not requesting a more interactive API, that can ping/interrupt/call other apps. That would be a very complex task for the vMix team. Other features might be much more important. So, in the meantime I return to the current topic and suggest that Audioman looks into how he might be able to hack the Activator MIDI calls to fulfill his needs.
DWAM  
#15 Posted: : Wednesday, April 19, 2017 11:41:39 AM(UTC)
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I partially disagree Richard: vMix API indicates states of nearly everything anytime and it can be used as a datasource for any other program which needs information. I do it manually by calling the API url with no parameter when I program just to check what I do but it could be used programmatically too. We also use it in vMix UTC on many operations. Last example Elgarf gave was a condition where a switch is done when another input audio fader reaches 0. This is done externally from a remote computer by requesting vMix state thru the API and it works within milliseconds, it is not an update every second! Lately Jens used the API as an XML datasource in vMix to retrieve the name and the duration of a playing video file in order to overlay its title...

So yeah, so far we mainly use the API to send commands but nothing prevents us from doing more at the same time and the other way around. The API works both ways! Let's be creative!

So ok, it's not pushed out of vMix but we can call it whenever we need and ok we can't know whether the last transition was a fade or a merge but do we need this for a control panel which btw is the one that sent the order?

Guillaume

PS : Jens video demonstrating how to use the API as a datasource:

Very inspiring !
thanks 1 user thanked DWAM for this useful post.
stevespaw on 4/20/2017(UTC)
Audioman  
#16 Posted : Thursday, April 20, 2017 4:22:25 AM(UTC)
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I tried calling the API dozens of times per second, and it works correctly, but the best solution and I will use, will be the activators.

Now I realize a 3 channels version for testing.

I measured a total latency of 1-2 ms using rtpMidi.
DWAM  
#17 Posted : Thursday, April 20, 2017 4:44:22 AM(UTC)
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Good!
You will soon discover that we miss a lot of activators but still it's possible to start with them.

A nice feature for a control panel using the API is the ability to retrieve inputs names. This would allow to label the buttons automatically. Also as Jens demonstrated you could have a small display showing which video is playing + remaining time. Besides, it's also possible to know which inputs are used in a multiview (activators or tallies can't do that so far). Such features would make a killer control panel for vMix.

Keep us posted!

A presto!
Audioman  
#18 Posted : Thursday, April 20, 2017 4:54:33 AM(UTC)
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I start the project with a simply control of preview and program, cute, fade etc via Midi.
Audioman  
#19 Posted : Thursday, April 20, 2017 8:57:17 AM(UTC)
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Works perfect, include T-bar.
Joeboe  
#20 Posted : Thursday, April 20, 2017 10:29:13 AM(UTC)
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Would like to see it and download it to try
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