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mikekay  
#1 Posted : Tuesday, December 29, 2015 8:17:03 PM(UTC)
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Greetings all. So there I am, on site, cameras working, screen broadcast up, all going well - and the main vMix computer blows up. What to do? I have separate recording of the cameras so I'll not lose data - but the screens will go dark.

How are others dealing with this? Do you have secondary computers running? Is there a way to automatically fail safe over to a back up computer? If so how?

As I start getting busy, this is going to become an issue worth considering.

Thanks.
Speegs  
#2 Posted : Wednesday, December 30, 2015 5:19:08 AM(UTC)
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Second computer and unfortunately there will be down time in a switchout.
HWL1223  
#3 Posted : Wednesday, January 6, 2016 10:56:39 AM(UTC)
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usually I run another PC with AFLME and taking a split feed from the main camera, to cover myself. But there would always be some black in the changeover - whether its a new address or just firing off the new upload.
"Its always something"
mikekay  
#4 Posted : Wednesday, January 6, 2016 11:12:11 AM(UTC)
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HWL wrote:
usually I run another PC with AFLME and taking a split feed from the main camera, to cover myself. But there would always be some black in the changeover - whether its a new address or just firing off the new upload.
"Its always something"


Thanks. Not sure what AFLME is. Can you elaborate?
mjgraves  
#5 Posted : Wednesday, January 6, 2016 11:23:07 AM(UTC)
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Please define "blows up" with a little more specificity.

Design of the host computer to address potential points of failure would be a good start. Dual CPU, ECC RAM, redundant PSUs fed by separate mains power, RAID storage subsystem...all standard fare in high availability hardware.

Simple "server class" hardware can be a bit of a problem since it often ignores video capabilities that vMix requires. You may be better of with "workstation class" hardware. That tends to be higher-performance for media applications.*

In the traditional video world where HD-SDI is the standard form of signaling you could use a video router at the core of your setup. That would allow you to send all signals to both main and backup computers. You'd only need to switch the source of the output streams.

I suppose that newer routers have a mix of HDMI and HD-SDI, so it could be possible in less uniform setups.

Of course, all that parallelism carries a considerable cost.

Michael

* I once worked for a broadcast graphics equipment manufacturer. We had a tough time picking motherboards for our products because popular server mobo's often had significant problems with real PCI performance and didn't support high-end graphics capabilities.
IceStream  
#6 Posted : Wednesday, January 6, 2016 11:26:30 AM(UTC)
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@ mikekay

I believe AFLME = Adobe Flash Media Live Encoder, more common acronym FMLE


Ice
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HWL1223 on 1/7/2016(UTC)
mikekay  
#7 Posted : Wednesday, January 6, 2016 11:32:15 AM(UTC)
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Thanks. A search brought up no useable results.
HWL1223  
#8 Posted : Thursday, January 7, 2016 6:12:00 PM(UTC)
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sorry for the abbreviation confusion.

I have seen everything twice and probably stuff not yet invented! Murphy lives!

All I have found is to bring at least a redundant machine, switch, camera and/or monitor close by, and a good disclaimer (and tools). Then it'll be their ISP going down or a power outage. Or a VP tripping over their network cables....

Murphy lives - I repeat myself.
mikekay  
#9 Posted : Thursday, January 7, 2016 6:18:01 PM(UTC)
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Murphy and I are old friends. I do festivals and events 200 times a year and I have seen things that go beyond anything a script writer could invent.

A full back up doubles the cost of everything. That's killer. Double computers, capture, software, wiring, etc..I am in the process of building a second computer for both vMix and Resolume, but with our dollar the lowest it has been in 12 years I'm being killed. Talk about Murphy.
Ittaidv  
#10 Posted : Friday, January 8, 2016 10:14:09 AM(UTC)
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Not the best solution for sure, but we have an Atomos Ninja 2 running alongside vmix. We record on it via hdmi out, as a backup in case of harddisk failure during transport.

In the rare case the computer would fail, we can reroute the main camera to the ninja, and keep recording. Our livestream would be cut for sure, but at least we would have almost the full recording.

We also use our zoom r16 for recording audio, in case the computer would fail, we also have a 8 track recording of all audio.

Those are all far from ideal solutions, since they require heavy editing afterwards, but at least you can always deliver a product.

This summer we recorded 2 stages of music at a festival, and the electricity generator of 1 stage failed a few times. Since the music on the stage and the lights also were cut, it wasn't a big deal.
Our mp4 recordings were damaged due to the power failures, but we recovered them using the grau video repair software. It worked on all material and nothing was lost. A UPS is now on the list for next summer though..

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Squier on 1/9/2016(UTC)
mikekay  
#11 Posted : Friday, January 8, 2016 10:21:40 AM(UTC)
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That's interesting. Thanks for the post. I am using BlackMagic Shuttle 2's for the same purpose. In the case of a full computer failure, I could reroute one HDMI from the Shuttle for a live feed.

Going to take a closer look at the Atomos unit.
Len56  
#12 Posted : Friday, January 8, 2016 12:08:21 PM(UTC)
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Also take a look at the new Blackmagic design Video Assist, it is cheaper and I believe it is of a higher resolution than the Atomos stuff and it uses the SDHC/SDXC UHS-I Memory Cards.
HWL1223  
#13 Posted : Friday, January 8, 2016 4:49:05 PM(UTC)
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Len56 wrote:
Also take a look at the new Blackmagic design Video Assist, it is cheaper and I believe it is of a higher resolution than the Atomos stuff and it uses the SDHC/SDXC UHS-I Memory Cards.


But as you recall, those solutions still depend on vMix or the PC working and still providing a mixed output...and my experience with multiple events (ingesting, switching, recording, streaming and outputting) has been bad. In my experience, of the 5 events, any 4 will work...for me at one time. (I assume this is a frame rate and format issue)
mikekay  
#14 Posted : Friday, January 8, 2016 4:51:31 PM(UTC)
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The BlackMagic units are $450 US each. With the Canadian dollar at a 12 year low, this unit would cost me $634 each, plus shipping. I wish I could afford them. And not for recording per say, but to get the expanded viewing.

Nice units.
Ittaidv  
#15 Posted : Friday, January 8, 2016 7:16:41 PM(UTC)
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The ninja 2 has dropped a lot in price, that's why we bought it :)

At b&h they are 295$ if you're in the US. Add a 1TB ssd and you got a killer backup system, + a small program monitor where you can check a few things like peaking for example.

In Europe some shops also offer the unit at reduced prices, i believe we paid 320 euro.
primpwrsolution  
#16 Posted : Sunday, April 26, 2020 6:30:09 AM(UTC)
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This is great information i like it i was in searching for this information and thinking to make a new thread for this but i have no need to make any new thread after read out this information thanks again for this.
primpwrsolution  
#17 Posted : Wednesday, May 6, 2020 7:43:45 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: mikekay Go to Quoted Post
Greetings all. So there I am, on site, cameras working, screen broadcast up, all going well - and the main vMix computer blows up. What to do? I have separate recording of the cameras so I'll not lose data - but the screens will go dark.

How are others dealing with this? Do you have secondary computers running? Is there a way to automatically fail safe over to a back up computer? If so how?

As I start getting busy, this is going to become an issue worth considering.

Thanks.



I think the issue here might be hardware related, your system doesn't probaly have the video capability that vMix require.

I use a workstation for all my work which is high performing and i haven't encounter such a blackout. You actually did great by backing up but i think it might black out when your attempt to change over. According to what i learnt on prime power solution, most server class hardware are not efficient as they often are not capable to handle such video quality.

I hope that helps.

prime power solution
al4video  
#18 Posted : Sunday, May 10, 2020 12:19:53 PM(UTC)
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I output a backup recording to my Atomos Shogun 7 monitor recorder which is also a 4 camera switcher recording program feed and 4 iso recordings.
You just need any simple encoder to take it up to the web in case of failure. https://www.adorama.com/atomshg701.html

I have thought seriously about The Roland V8 HD although I would prefer SDI over HDMI for purposes of long runs. https://www.adorama.com/rov8hd.html?origterm=roland+v-8hd+18-channel+hd+video+switcher+8x+hdmi+inputs&searchredirect=true
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