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Need to learn more about advanced audio setup with external mixer and vMix
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Hi all!
As mentioned in the title I need to get familiar with a more advanced adio setup together with vmix.
This is an early stage for me to get as much information and knowledge as possible in a (maybe) total makeover in our mcr, studio and external incoming feeds where we may be looking into replacing an oldschool modular setup with a more integrated setup. Here vMix may be a contender.
The part were I feel my knowledge lacks the most is setting up a more advanced audio environment with vMix.
Here we want a physical mixer doing all det audio mixing and then put it back into vMix as a master audio. We also need to produce a couple of IFB channels for talkback into telephone hybrids, a pc etc.
The audio we need to manage will be analouge from studio microphones, embedded audio from SDI signals, vMix internal audio from file playout, screen mirroring ,replays etc and maybe some other audio from maybe a separate pc.
What I think I am asking for now, initially is pointers to good examples to look at, youtube tutorials etc etc. Just to get started and get a hint of what hardware is needed, what works and not.
My research so far has brought up something called Dante mixers as a possible way to go. But maybe there are other ways too.
Thanks in advance for any input regarding this!
/T
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For your purpose I highly recommend the behringer wing. Physical lots of I/O. A bit smaller is the XR18. I have made a video about it. Both behave the same in combination with vMix. Another option I could see is a Shure P300 on the Dante side but offers little physical I/O. For a Mic and speaker ok. But for different mix minus def not. Maybe start with the video and if you have further question just ping me.
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 1 user thanked mavik for this useful post.
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We use a Midas M32 mixer connected via USB to vMix. Most of our audio comes from microphones and all mixing is done on the M32, we DO also play MP3 audio files and videos from vMix which we output to the M32 via one of the vMix Audio Buses and of course post mixer it's fed back to vMix as the Master audio.
All of our cameras are NDI but we do not use any audio from the cameras at all and our camera are not positioned to get good audio, rather they are positioned for good video.
As noted in the other reply, you do need to take care to not send anything to the mixer AND the Master output at the same time because you'll get the doubled audio but that's not hard to avoid though be sure to turn OFF the "Automatically Mix Audio" on your various inputs.
If you do use camera audio inputs be sure to keep each of them on separate vMix Audio buses that can be sent to your mixer and thus mixed separately.
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We use the XR18 the MR18 (Midas, almost identical to X18) and Soundcraft UI24R.
By far my preference is the Soundcraft, it has independent delay on aux channels for large rooms, no software required for the ui, its browser based, lastly it has a feedback killer that really zeros in on the problem frequency(ies).
TIPS, ingest into vmix from the mixer via aux channel outs, do not use vmixes mixer with independent channels, its feature poor. Main out is for the room, not vmix.
Do mixing on the mixer (or better yet have the audio guy/gal do the mixing on the mixer)
If you need to send audio from vmix to your mixer, do it via a vmix bus that sends to a pair of unused inputs on the mixer -over usb (and of course those inputs are muted in the aux channels that go to vmix) [Settings-->Audio Outputs]
It'll take a bit to wrap your head around it but experiment and have fun before the gig.
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1 user thanked SuperBill for this useful post.
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Originally Posted by: SuperBill  We use the XR18 the MR18 (Midas, almost identical to X18) and Soundcraft UI24R.
By far my preference is the Soundcraft, it has independent delay on aux channels for large rooms, no software required for the ui, its browser based, lastly it has a feedback killer that really zeros in on the problem frequency(ies).
TIPS, ingest into vmix from the mixer via aux channel outs, do not use vmixes mixer with independent channels, its feature poor. Main out is for the room, not vmix.
Do mixing on the mixer (or better yet have the audio guy/gal do the mixing on the mixer)
If you need to send audio from vmix to your mixer, do it via a vmix bus that sends to a pair of unused inputs on the mixer -over usb (and of course those inputs are muted in the aux channels that go to vmix) [Settings-->Audio Outputs]
It'll take a bit to wrap your head around it but experiment and have fun before the gig. Thanks for input! One question about the Soundcraft UI24R: can this be used with a physical mixer interface with faders, buttons etc?
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Someone has made a midi map for the X-Air control surface, apparently its very functional, but there are limitations, so in that way yes, but nothing native. If you want physical control Soundcraft does make larger mixers with that
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Hi again and thanks for all the input!
One question which have popped up is this one:
If I want to do all the mixing on the external mixer, for example an X32 and send audio from vmix inputs on buses to the x32, do the mixing with other audio sources on the mixer and then put the master mix back into vmix as master audio, are there any pitfalls here concerning getting everything synched?
I´ve heard about a case nearby here where they send the audio from a vmix input (i think an incoming livestream) on a bus into an external videomixer (zoom i think) for mixing. But when audio was fed back into vmix as master this audo was behind video...
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What SuperBill describes is how ours is set up as well. Audio is all mixed on the mixer and fed to vMix.
You can set a default audio delay in vMix in Audio tab of the main Settings to get them back into sync.
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Originally Posted by: TL68 Hi again and thanks for all the input!
One question which have popped up is this one:
If I want to do all the mixing on the external mixer, for example an X32 and send audio from vmix inputs on buses to the x32, do the mixing with other audio sources on the mixer and then put the master mix back into vmix as master audio, are there any pitfalls here concerning getting everything synched?
I´ve heard about a case nearby here where they send the audio from a vmix input (i think an incoming livestream) on a bus into an external videomixer (zoom i think) for mixing. But when audio was fed back into vmix as master this audo was behind video...
If you're bringing audio in when it's sync with the video and outboarding it, that will inevitably add some delay. In case of an incoming livestream that's probably a no-can-do problem, but for other sources like a laptop for VT playback, you can use a de-embedder on the SDI or HDMI input and split the audio to the audio mixer before the video hits vMix. We do that and bring the audio into vMix via Dante. Even with the non-zero delay that that adds, audio still has to be delayed ~80ms to be in sync with video.
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Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 12/8/2022(UTC) Posts: 96 Thanks: 26 times
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Hi Again!
Head is spinning a bit after looking on gazillion video tutorials about mixers. I May have learned a bit. I May have gotten a bit more confused. But anyhow. now I could need some more recommendations on mixers that will do the most important job for our production setup well together with vMix and this is:
- Compact footprint with max 50-60cm width.
- At least 16 physical faders available at the same time with 16 inputs. One input on each fader. No faders for main production audio should need to be activated by extra button pressing. These faders produce a main mix audio out on XLR and/or USB to vMix.
- At least four different ifb/mix minus channels for different communications with studio, reporters, guests etc. These channels must have both XLR and USB outbut (to go back to the vmix computer)
- These ifb/mix minus channel outputs must be controlled/accessed by pressing one dedicated button for each ifb-channel to make the faders active to control levels on inputs that is sent to the ifbchannel instead of the main mix. And then a single buttonpress to return to main mix mode for the faders
- Good compability with vmix to send audio from and to vmix via USB
- Max cost 3000 euro
The main use for the mixers is a control room setup for live broadcasts mixing live feeds from reporters out in the field with studio host, recorded video, externa videocalls like meets (no zoom in our operation), replay, external telephone calls on hybrid input etc.
Which are the main contenders here?
Thanks in advance!
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Rank: Advanced Member
Groups: Registered
Joined: 11/23/2020(UTC) Posts: 212 Location: Wichita Thanks: 11 times
Was thanked: 28 time(s) in 24 post(s)
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Originally Posted by: TL68 Hi Again!
Head is spinning a bit after looking on gazillion video tutorials about mixers. I May have learned a bit. I May have gotten a bit more confused. But anyhow. now I could need some more recommendations on mixers that will do the most important job for our production setup well together with vMix and this is:
- Compact footprint with max 50-60cm width.
- At least 16 physical faders available at the same time with 16 inputs. One input on each fader. No faders for main production audio should need to be activated by extra button pressing. These faders produce a main mix audio out on XLR and/or USB to vMix.
- At least four different ifb/mix minus channels for different communications with studio, reporters, guests etc. These channels must have both XLR and USB outbut (to go back to the vmix computer)
- These ifb/mix minus channel outputs must be controlled/accessed by pressing one dedicated button for each ifb-channel to make the faders active to control levels on inputs that is sent to the ifbchannel instead of the main mix. And then a single buttonpress to return to main mix mode for the faders
- Good compability with vmix to send audio from and to vmix via USB
- Max cost 3000 euro
The main use for the mixers is a control room setup for live broadcasts mixing live feeds from reporters out in the field with studio host, recorded video, externa videocalls like meets (no zoom in our operation), replay, external telephone calls on hybrid input etc.
Which are the main contenders here?
Thanks in advance! Behringer X32 Compact or Behringer X32 Rack. Note that the rack version requires the use of a phone, tablet or PC to control. The Behringer X32 Compact is a mixer with physical controls but it too can be controlled by a phone, tablet or PC while the Rack version has no physical sliders. The X32 would give you 32 channels to work with which is a lot more than the 16 you specified but that gives you room to grow. You can also get a Behringer XR18 Air or Behringer XR16 Air but both of those are like the X32 Rack (no physical sliders) but have only 18 or 16 channels with the XR18 giving you only 2 spare channels and the XR16 no spares but both are much cheaper. I have experience with the M32, X32 and XR18 Air which is why I can recommend them. We had for some time an overflow auditorium and one sound guy who sat in there and controlled the mix with a Tablet for that room on our X32 while the main auditorium got it's own mix by the sound person at the physical controls. These days if the program is simple I can operate the M32 (got it when the X32 had to be repaired, it took 8 months to fix and now it's "spare") from the same PC as vMix just on it's own monitor but it's usually much better if we have a dedicated sound person.
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Rank: Advanced Member
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Joined: 12/8/2022(UTC) Posts: 96 Thanks: 26 times
Was thanked: 1 time(s) in 1 post(s)
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Originally Posted by: Roy Sinclair Originally Posted by: TL68 Hi Again!
Head is spinning a bit after looking on gazillion video tutorials about mixers. I May have learned a bit. I May have gotten a bit more confused. But anyhow. now I could need some more recommendations on mixers that will do the most important job for our production setup well together with vMix and this is:
- Compact footprint with max 50-60cm width.
- At least 16 physical faders available at the same time with 16 inputs. One input on each fader. No faders for main production audio should need to be activated by extra button pressing. These faders produce a main mix audio out on XLR and/or USB to vMix.
- At least four different ifb/mix minus channels for different communications with studio, reporters, guests etc. These channels must have both XLR and USB outbut (to go back to the vmix computer)
- These ifb/mix minus channel outputs must be controlled/accessed by pressing one dedicated button for each ifb-channel to make the faders active to control levels on inputs that is sent to the ifbchannel instead of the main mix. And then a single buttonpress to return to main mix mode for the faders
- Good compability with vmix to send audio from and to vmix via USB
- Max cost 3000 euro
The main use for the mixers is a control room setup for live broadcasts mixing live feeds from reporters out in the field with studio host, recorded video, externa videocalls like meets (no zoom in our operation), replay, external telephone calls on hybrid input etc.
Which are the main contenders here?
Thanks in advance! Behringer X32 Compact or Behringer X32 Rack. Note that the rack version requires the use of a phone, tablet or PC to control. The Behringer X32 Compact is a mixer with physical controls but it too can be controlled by a phone, tablet or PC while the Rack version has no physical sliders. The X32 would give you 32 channels to work with which is a lot more than the 16 you specified but that gives you room to grow. You can also get a Behringer XR18 Air or Behringer XR16 Air but both of those are like the X32 Rack (no physical sliders) but have only 18 or 16 channels with the XR18 giving you only 2 spare channels and the XR16 no spares but both are much cheaper. I have experience with the M32, X32 and XR18 Air which is why I can recommend them. We had for some time an overflow auditorium and one sound guy who sat in there and controlled the mix with a Tablet for that room on our X32 while the main auditorium got it's own mix by the sound person at the physical controls. These days if the program is simple I can operate the M32 (got it when the X32 had to be repaired, it took 8 months to fix and now it's "spare") from the same PC as vMix just on it's own monitor but it's usually much better if we have a dedicated sound person. Thanks for responding, Roy! A question regarding the X32: seems as if the 8 left faders and 8 right faders are grouped. Do they have different functionality or can all 16 (8+8) be used as regular input faders? And: how would you set up the function to control the 4 ifb mix minus channels so you easily can activate the faders to control them instead of main mix?
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